Sump pump near soil pipe?

[DHill]

I've been exploring the possibility of waterproofing my basement in order to finish it. My home is an older arts and crafts with a sloping basement floor going toward the soil pipe which exits in the floor, rather than the wall as I've seen in other homes. My question is: if I were to install French drains and a sump pump, all water slopes to the lowest point which is my sewer drain, so how do I configure a sump that close to the sewer drain? I would be concerned about backup. Anyone else have an example?
PS:
To direct rainwater to the sewer drain is against code, as it would send rainwater during storms to the sewer and therefore the water treatment plant. Not only is this additional water unmetered, it causes surges and potential discharge of overflows to the rivers during big storms, which potentially contaminates the drinking water source. Mmm. So I'd prefer to avoid contributing to that if I can help it.

Presently basement only has minor moisture but isn't dry enough to wall in.

[GeoffD]

I've been exploring the possibility of waterproofing my basement in order to finish it. My home is an older arts and crafts with a sloping basement floor going toward the soil pipe which exits in the floor, rather than the wall as I've seen in other homes. My question is: if I were to install French drains and a sump pump, all water slopes to the lowest point which is my sewer drain, so how do I configure a sump that close to the sewer drain? I would be concerned about backup. Anyone else have an example?
PS:
To direct rainwater to the sewer drain is against code, as it would send rainwater during storms to the sewer and therefore the water treatment plant. Not only is this additional water unmetered, it causes surges and potential discharge of overflows to the rivers during big storms, which potentially contaminates the drinking water source. Mmm. So I'd prefer to avoid contributing to that if I can help it.

Presently basement only has minor moisture but isn't dry enough to wall in.

I'm confused. Your waste water plumbing system is 100% sealed in pipe. If it wasn't, your house would reek of sewer gasses. How could water from french drains and a sump pump possibly get into the sewer pipe unless you intentionally plumb it up that way? Everybody else in the world just pumps the water with the sump pump as far away from the house as possible.

Next question:
Are the walls damp? If so, the first thing to look at is the drainage around the foundation. Do you have 10' of downhill slope away from the foundation walls with a drop of at least 6"? Do you have at least 6" of exposed foundation wall before dirt starts? Do your gutters work and do your downspouts channel the water from the roof away from the house that same 10 feet? A little regrading and getting the water from your downspouts away from the house might solve 90% of your problem.

I have a high groundwater problem. I just had a perimeter drain installed around the house last week. My wet problem is solved forever but I wouldn't wish my excavator bill on anybody.

[matoo]

You don't need to place the pump in the center. The idea of drain tile and a sump is to handle the water before it gets above the floor level. Bust up the floor and put drain tile around the edges and connect it to the pit. Pump the water out and make sure it gets away from the house. Done deal.
It will get rid of the ground water before it ever has a chance to make the floor wet.

[DHill]

The soil pipe enters the basement floor at a drain hole. It must have some backflow prevention or check-valve because because it doesn't smell and hasn't for the five years I've owned the house. It may be a P-trap (hopefully this picture works):



So the problem is that the entire basement floor slopes toward this drain, and this drain is the lowest point in the basement. If I were to put french drains along the perimeter, they would slope to this point as well, and obviously having my sump pump and my soil pipe drain co-located would be messy. So that's what I'm trying to figure out. How can I have the sump pump and basement drain separate without re-grading my basement floor?

[Phatbastard]

I think some of the issue is terminology. You are using "soil pipe" incorrectly. What you are showing there is a drain that then would feed into your soil pipe. There is no P-trap on a soil pipe, it runs straight to the sewer and back up to the roof vent without any restrictions or traps - you can put a check valve on a soil pipe but it's unusual. I would call that a soil stack where you are calling it a soil pipe.

So, that drain is connected to the soil stack. Why not dig the sump around it and then feed the sump pump into that. Unless there is some regulation that prevents running sump water into sewer water - that is not the case in my area.

edit - sorry, I just re-read where you said you can't put it in the sewer by code.

[GeoffD]

I think some of the issue is terminology. You are using "soil pipe" incorrectly.

I want to see a photo. He's making it sound like he has an open drain in his cellar that feeds into the sewer line.

I have an open drain in my cellar in my Vermont place but it's part of the surface and groundwater drainage system. The drain feeds into a PVC pipe that runs underneath the concrete floor and feeds into the perimeter drain outside. My waste water goes elsewhere, of course.

[unimogken]

I want to see a photo.

Me to because this thread is hurting my head!

[unimogken]

Bueller?

[NYCgolf]

I think i understand your issue:

The spot in your basement where you would like to put your sump pit is in the same corner as your main soil line exits. You know this is where your main drain is because there is a cap (should be 2 caps).

I think this is super common i had the same issue in my house. I put my pit in front of the trap. I didn't want to be too close to the wall anyway because i was nervous about undermining the footing.

[NYCgolf]

Also to add:

You are going to want to locate where your plumbing is before you start jack hammering up the floor.

In my case i put the pipe about a 3 feet from the wall on one side, because there was drain pipe close to the wall and i did not want to get involved with it.

i will see if i have some pics.

[NYCgolf]

In the corner of this pic you can see where i put my pit. The pipe going up is the vent for the main trap.