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Quote, originally posted by winstonsmith84 » If this were 1900, you would be correct. That was when money had style and taste, not flash.
You spoiled my joke. I hate you.
Quote, originally posted by DIAF » If you can afford a million dollar car, there's no such thing as a recession.
Yeah but during a recession, even if you can afford it, do you want to send that message to people that you can? Boats and houses and airplanes are for the most part hidden, a Rolls-Royce driving down a street is not.
Quote, originally posted by winstonsmith84 » If this were 1900, you would be correct. That was when money had style and taste, not flash.
You spoiled my joke. I hate you.
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Originally Posted by Hodor
With luxury cars, you're not going to get much more for your money once you pass, say, $1,000,000. If you're that rich, and if you're tacky enough to want to show it off, you could always have the whole thing gold-plated and encrusted in jewels.Rich people are perfectly happy getting chauffeured in limos. They'll bring out the collectibles when they want to show off.
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Drum beats louder
Drum beats louder
Quote, originally posted by Fritz27 »
You spoiled my joke. I hate you.Don't worry, I got it.
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Quote, originally posted by Matt D. » Probably because most already had yachts. I imagine folks choosing not to upgrade to bigger and better boats stressed the industry. Conspicuous consumption was in full flare during the downturn.
Just like the used car market, for them to be able to upgrade, they need to unload their current boat. Right now the number of yacht manufacturers in bankruptcy or very near to it is probably greater than 50%.
This recession definitly hurt the wealthy.
Quote, originally posted by justanotherusername » That's not true at all, at least not with this one. The yacht industry was/is on the verge of collapse during this downturn. The wealthy took HUGE losses when the financial firms failed.
Their huge losses still leave them ridiculously wealthy. In looking for Rolls Royce sales numbers (they had their best year ever in 2008, and expect this year to be flat this year), I found the following paragraph from April of this year:
Quote » Forbes reported last month the number of billionaires all over the world have come down to 793 from 1,125 a year ago and their average wealth dropped 23 percent over the past 12 months to $3 billion (two billion pounds). So there was a 30% reduction in the number of billionaires as a result of this economic downturn. Average wealth among billionaires is still $3Billion dollars.
They can afford whatever the hell they want...I'd say that there's not much of a quality of life difference between $3billion and $4billion, would you?
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Quote, originally posted by clutch_dust » I have to admit, this is not a very cool story, bro.
i really wish this and all associated pictures would just go away.i dont think that there is a market for new cars in that range but there will always be collector cars going up that way and they will always be worth that much to someone really. hell, if i had that much money, id be sitting in my dream aston martin db4gt zagato and feeling it appreciate rather than plunk down some money on a new whatever and having it depreciate.
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Quote, originally posted by DIAF »
So there was a 30% reduction in the number of billionaires as a result of this economic downturn. Average wealth among billionaires is still $3Billion dollars.They can afford whatever the hell they want...I'd say that there's not much of a quality of life difference between $3billion and $4billion, would you?
Sure the billionaires can still afford it, but that's not what you said. Does it not occur to you that there was also a reduction in the number of people who were worth $10 million, or $5 million, and that reduction reduced the number of buyers for expensive cars?
If you think the wealthy was immune from the current recesion you're not living in reality.
Quote, originally posted by GTRaavv »
Anyways, I think Bugatti has done relatively well selling a $1million+ car.I believe VW has already admitted that the Veyron project will be a huge net loss when the project is complete. So i wouldn't say it is a profitable market.
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You gotta wear your shoes.
They buy this you idiot
Or, if they are really crazy about cars, this......
Now wake up.
Quote, originally posted by A.Wilder » I believe VW has already admitted that the Veyron project will be a huge net loss when the project is complete. So i wouldn't say it is a profitable market.
It was already understood by Bugatti that building the Veyron would come at a financial lost, IIRC. Their goal wasn't profit anyway. I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of $5 million to build a Veyron.
Modified by Matt D. at 8:20 AM 9-11-2009
Quote, originally posted by justanotherusername » Sure the billionaires can still afford it, but that's not what you said. Does it not occur to you that there was also a reduction in the number of people who were worth $10 million, or $5 million, and that reduction reduced the number of buyers for expensive cars?
If you think the wealthy was immune from the current recesion you're not living in reality.
I don't think they're immune, but the lifestyle of the truly wealthy is.
If you can legitimately afford a $1,000,000 car, your lifestyle is not going to be drastically affected by a recession. A depression, sure, but a slow-down won't have you sharing a one bedroom apartment with two other guys and eating Ramen noodles.
As for who's living in reality, keep your thoughts to yourself.
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When you sell a car, update both. Comprehensive lists and cool graphs are in the first post of each thread.
The highest price ever paid for a single vehicle at auction was a Ferrari that went for over $12M at an RM Auction. This appears to be the ceiling, for now.
Quote, originally posted by DIAF » I don't think they're immune, but the lifestyle of the truly wealthy is.
If you can legitimately afford a $1,000,000 car, your lifestyle is not going to be drastically affected by a recession. A depression, sure, but a slow-down won't have you sharing a one bedroom apartment with two other guys and eating Ramen noodles.
As for who's living in reality, keep your thoughts to yourself.
Theres also those whose whealth comes from WAY WAY WAY back then. Things that are'nt affected by current economy.
If we're talking new-build cars, no. What content could possibly be added to justify such a high price?Collector cars are a whole 'nother story.
Quote, originally posted by DIAF » I don't think they're immune, but the lifestyle of the truly wealthy is.
If you can legitimately afford a $1,000,000 car, your lifestyle is not going to be drastically affected by a recession. A depression, sure, but a slow-down won't have you sharing a one bedroom apartment with two other guys and eating Ramen noodles.
As for who's living in reality, keep your thoughts to yourself.
No one said anything about them being broke, only that they have cut back on big ticket items, you know, like the subject of this thread. The FACT is that the recession DID hurt the wealthy, and it caused them to tighten up on the spending. I'm not sure how you can possibly sit there and refute this when every nearly single luxury make has suffered sales declines over the last year. The number of people who could afford a car like this was reduced.
There were TRILLIONS of dollars of wealth lost when the markets declined, and you can bet your ass that all those billionaires don't just stick their money in CDs where it's safe.
Quote, originally posted by justanotherusername » No one said anything about them being broke, only that they have cut back on big ticket items, you know, like the subject of this thread. The FACT is that the recession DID hurt the wealthy, and it caused them to tighten up on the spending. I'm not sure how you can possibly sit there and refute this when every nearly single luxury make has suffered sales declines over the last year. The number of people who could afford a car like this was reduced.
There were TRILLIONS of dollars of wealth lost when the markets declined, and you can bet your ass that all those billionaires don't just stick their money in CDs where it's safe.
That link, yeah, that's exactly what I said above.
You're some kind of miserable to want to fight so much.
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When you sell a car, update both. Comprehensive lists and cool graphs are in the first post of each thread.
It wouldn't necessarily be "better" but the appointments would be more rare. For $10 million it better have seats, dash, and headliner made from the skin of third-world impoverished children. And I mean the ones that wear clothes.....no UV damage like those loincloth kids. It would also need to have a shifter made out of the femur of somebody famous, like FDR or something. Hugh Grant's teeth could be used as radio preset buttons. Julia Roberts' horsemouth is the air intake. And Karl Malden nose bumpers.
Quote, originally posted by felixthecat » How much better would a $10 million car be?
Mike, quote me in your signature
Quote, originally posted by DIAF » That link, yeah, that's exactly what I said above.
You're some kind of miserable to want to fight so much.
The hell it did. You said the wealthy don't feel recessions, and that's just idiotic.
Let me quote it for you since you obivously can't read:
Quote »
Figures released yesterday showed that after 30 years of swelling fortunes they have become, in real terms, poorer over the past two years.
Last year, the ranks of those worth at least £20million plunged by nearly a quarter.Plunging fortunes: Bill Gates (left) and Warren Buffett have both lost billions
According to the annual World Wealth Report by CapGemini and Merrill Lynch, Britain's wealthy were among the worst hit, with the number of High Net Worth Individuals - those with at least £600,000 in investible assets - falling by 26.3 per cent to 326,000 in 2008.
That pushed the UK down one spot to fourth in the world's rich list, with China climbing up a spot to third, below the U.S., Japan and Germany.
Monthly income from stock dividends, which is concentrated among the affluent, also fell more than 20 per cent since last summer, the biggest decline since records began half a century ago.Fewer people in the catagory means fewer sales, and it is BECAUSE of the recession, which you say they don't feel.
I'm not miserable at all, but you must be some kind of stupid to even attempt to argue this when you're so obviously wrong.
Quote, originally posted by ATL_Av8r » It wouldn't necessarily be "better" but the appointments would be more rare. For $10 million it better have seats, dash, and headliner made from the skin of third-world impoverished children. And I mean the ones that wear clothes.....no UV damage like those loincloth kids. It would also need to have a shifter made out of the femur of somebody famous, like FDR or something. Hugh Grant's teeth could be used as radio preset buttons. Julia Roberts' horsemouth is the air intake. And Karl Malden nose bumpers.
LOL
People that have 2-10 million to drop on a vehicle usually want to travel in something like this:
2004 Learjet 40. Your's for only $4,890,000 obo.
http://www.n1aviation.com/Lear40.htm
Quote, originally posted by powderhound » People that have 2-10 million to drop on a vehicle usually want to travel in something like this:
No they don't. They drop some coin on this
As the expenses on this
Quote, originally posted by powderhound » 2004 Learjet 40. Your's for only $4,890,000 obo.
Will eat you alive hour by hour.
Modified by winstonsmith84 at 9:15 AM 9-11-2009
Heard of some gravesites, out by the highway,
a place where nobody knows
Quote, originally posted by GTE77 » Theres also those whose whealth comes from WAY WAY WAY back then. Things that are'nt affected by current economy.
At 350 million Dollars for a yacht...why not just purchase a cruiseliner to start?
To answer the OP: no.There really is no market for a 5-10m car. They want toys like helicopters and yachts. The wealthiest person I know prefers to ride a Moto Guzzi dualsport motorcycle when going between places on tarmac, other than that he has planes, a chopper and some yachts.
Quote, originally posted by jastevenson »
Sure, but some "old" Ferrari from the 60s isn't going to impress the average man-on-the-street, who just sees some nicely-taken-care-of old car (or kit-car).Rich people want vehicles that make people say "Wow, that guy is rich."
Why wouldn't REALLY rich people want a vehicle that makes people say "Wow, that guy in the regular Rolls is a nobody compared with this guy!"
You don't know anyone with 'mega' wealth do you....
Quote, originally posted by NightTrain EX » At 350 million Dollars for a yacht...why not just purchase a cruiseliner to start?
well, a 'cheaply' outfitted cruiseliner starts at around ~750m+. I'm sure his $350m yacht spares no expense and to outfit an oceanliner in a similar fashion would be well into the billions.
$12+M Ferrari at RM Auction Source.
Modified by Michael Blue at 1:35 PM 9-11-2009
Quote, originally posted by torxim »
well, a 'cheaply' outfitted cruiseliner starts at around ~750m+. I'm sure his $350m yacht spares no expense and to outfit an oceanliner in a similar fashion would be well into the billions.I was just thinking starting with a retired cruise liner and refitting it.
I have no proof of this, but I believe that most cars that cost over a million bucks are already only priced that way because of exclusivity and not because of parts and labor or design. The veyron and its 28 year long design program may be an exception... but the lamborghini reventon, for instance, I am fairly sure - did not cost 3 million dollars to produce.This would lead me to believe that there is a market for any priced car so long as there is someone out there dumb enough to buy it. Filthy rich people that just want something that no one else will ever have will pay any amount of money to get what they want. over 10 million? sure.
Modified by x1000rpms at 11:51 AM 9-11-2009
Quote » Rich people want vehicles that make people say "Wow, that guy is rich." Why wouldn't REALLY rich people want a vehicle that makes people say "Wow, that guy in the regular Rolls is a nobody compared with this guy!"
I guess we'll have to see how this pans out over time. From the people I know, being rich and being wealthy are two different states of mind.
Most people I know, are actually rather practical - in a relative sense - and tend to spend more on items that they want to enjoy. Whether or not these are a statement to other people, isn't the primary consideration - so much as the cost-benefit of the acquisition.
For instance, the planes, yachts, homes - these are all things with higher perceived use-value. I'd like to go somewhere far, fast. I'd like to relax on a yacht - or cruise the med. I'd like to spend a summer on the coast. I want a place in Hawai'i that I can use any time I want. Etc...
Most people just see cars as a means to an end, no matter how much money they have. So they will use whatever is the most convenient and comfortable to them. In many cases, this would just mean limo service, and fore-going driving altogether. In other cases, it may mean the Rolls or Bentley - or it may just mean a Lincoln/Cadillac car or SUV.
While some 'rich' people who feel the need to use their car as a statement of how rich they are compared to others - other 'rich' people expect that you either already know who they are, or you don't.
All that said, I do know of a million dollar car that a few 'rich' people would buy:
Quote » The Luttrells — she's 37, he's 47 — are part of a thriving high-end RV culture. Contrary to RVs' blue-collar image — and undeterred by soaring gasoline prices — a growing number of executives (including Liberty Media CEO John Malone), doctors, and other professionals prefer to spend their leisure time in coaches that sell for $1 million to $2 million and have interior appointments reminiscent of old-style Pullman cars. Many owners also tow "toy haulers" behind their RVs — trailers that carry cars, his-and-her motorcycles, golf carts, or motorized Segways. My point being, you could spec one of these out to $5 Million - plus, and probably find a buyer - faster than a "car".
If I were to make $5Mil + automobiles, they would be limousines or RVs.
Modified by PsyberVW at 12:06 PM 9-11-2009
Cars are already cresting 2 million USD - That is a lot for what buyers are receiving.
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